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Lower-Thirds via UltraStudio and "Alpha-only Mode for Outputs"?

cmiavcmiav
in MAIN
The "Alpha-only Mode for Outputs" seems like a simple means to implement lower thirds via key and fill, but unfortunately because there is no frame sync between the 2 outputs from the Mac, high -motion key and fills do not stay in sync.

Can this be solved by incorporating a single UltraStudio HD? I've seen the BlackMagic systems used with ProPresenter and Xpression produce a synced key/fill, but Millumin only sees the UltraStudio with a single output.

Can Millumin send alpha channel info to the Ultrastudio for key and fill output from the SDI outputs? Any guidance would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Comments

  • MilluminMillumin

    Hello @cmiav,

    This is a feature from Blacmagic devices and it would require some job to be implemented in Millumin. For now, this is not planned but we will study this idea.

    If some news, I will reply in this thread.

    Best. Philippe

  • MilluminMillumin

    Hello @cmiav,

    A short message to let you know that latest beta (4.17.d) supports Blackmagic keyers.

    More info in this post.

    Best. Philippe

  • FredLaFAFredLaFA

    Yummy

  • OCGuyOCGuy

    Trying to play with this feature in the Beta version. Where do you find the this window to activate? Does this cause the ultrastudio to output seperate key and fill on SDI A&B or Millumin content of the SDI input on the ultrastudio? Thanks for the assist!

    image.png


  • OCGuyOCGuy

    Found it. For others looking when you select the ultrastudio as an output on the expanded list where you select the resolution/rate at the bottom of that list is "settings".

  • cmiavcmiav

    Glad to see the Blackmagic Keying feature now in beta, but I'm having some trouble getting good results.

    When I switch the keyer setting to "External", the two SDI monitors (on outputs A and B) show an "out of range" warning then a solid red screen.

    Switching the keyer setting back to "Internal" shows the same full color video, output identically on both A and B monitor. Not seeing a grey scale version on either output.

  • cmiavcmiav

    Hello @Millumin

    Thanks for the new keying feature in beta. In testing, Millumin can send output video to the UltraStudio HD Mini, but both hardware SDI outputs unfortunately show the same full-color video as from the canvas. Toggling the keyer setting in Millumin from internal to external causes an "out of range" warning on both SDI monitors. Any tips?

  • MilluminMillumin

    Hello @cmiav,

    What Blackmagic device are you using ?

    We tested with an Ultrastudio HD Mini and everything is fine in both 8-bit and 10-bit rendering.

    Best. Philippe

    PS : the "internal" keyer will mix 2 feeds to a single output (displaying the final compositing), so it is normal to have the same image on both SDI (see Blackmagic documentation).

  • cmiavcmiav

    @Millumin

    Hi Phillippe,

    Thanks for the follow up. Maybe I am incorrectly configuring the set up.

    We are testing with an UltraStudio HD Mini which is connected by a single thunderbolt cable. In Millumin, a single canvas with a transparent background is set to output to the UltraStudio HD Mini.

    Two SDI output are being sent from the UltraStudio Mini to two external monitors.

    When the keyer is set to "internal" I see the composited image, identical on both monitors.

    When the keyer is set to "external" setting, the external monitors display "out of range" warning. Same result in 8bit or 10bit.

  • MilluminMillumin

    Hello @cmiav,

    Millumin is just using the Blackmagic libraries on macOS, then what the device is doing is a black box for us.

    This is odd as with the same setup (using a Blackmagic Video Assist 7” 12G HDR to check SDI outputs), we never had such an issue. Could you check with Blackmagic capture card (or a Blackmagic monitor) that you also have the problem ?

    Could you also check Blackmagic Desktop Video Setup, so you are sure that there is no option that could lead to such a behavior ?

    Best. Philippe

  • cmiavcmiav

    Hello @Millumin

    Thank you for the advice to swap monitors. The key and fill feature is working correctly now after having swapped out the DataVideo 700HD monitors for a pair of BlackMagic SmartView HD monitors.

    Strange that the Data Video monitors can display Millumin content via the internal switcher setting, but won't display content from the external switcher setting.

    Thanks for the guidance to see this feature in action. The frame sync between the key and fill is excellent.

  • MilluminMillumin

    Hello @cmiav,

    I doubt the problem comes from Millumin, as the SDI format all depends on the Blackmagic UltraStudio HD Mini.

    It rather looks like the DataVideo 700HD monitor is not able to process the SDI signal from the Blackmagic UltraStudio HD Mini : maybe because of the resolution (it does not support 1080p60, only 1080i60), maybe because of the format (it seems to only support HD/SD-YUV).

    I recommend you to contact Blackmagic ot DataVideo support to learn more about your issue.

    Best. Philippe

  • cmiavcmiav

    Yes the strange part is that the 700HD has no trouble to display the same 1080p/60 Millumin canvas without problem when using the internal scaler setting. Through the ultra studio mini there is no problem using the internal scaler setting.

    However when the setting is switched from internal to external setting in Millumin software, something about the SDI signal changes, and the data path monitors reject the external scaler signal.

    I’ll see what black magic says, and test with a Barco switcher when next possible.

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